Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi  

London, UK
6 August 1985  

Now My stay in England is completing its 12th year and that is the reason I wanted to talk to you people about Sahaja Yoga. How far it has gone and where are we lacking.

The greatest thing that has happened is that we have established our religion: Nirmala Dharma as we call it, the Vishwa Nirmala Dharma. And you know the meanings of the words, vishwa means universal, nirmala means pure and dharma means religion. This has been established in America. And we have to register it here in England.

Now it is very important that, when we belong to a religion, we have to know what are the commandments of that religion is. And so far we have not drafted anything. It cannot be a thing made suitable to people or suitable to human beings. It cannot be. And it cannot compromise with your suitability.

Like in Russia, as I told you the story, I went there and I said, ‛I would like to see a church.“ So they took me down to a church, which was the Orthodox Greek Church, and My husband was also there where we were VIPs, so the head of the church came down and took us to lunch; and he said that today, these days, they are fasting so he cannot take any meat.  We said, ‛Alright.“ We all sat down, but he went on drinking, drinking, drinking. So much so, that he forgot that he had guests or anything! He never even came to see us off! So the officers who were with us started all laughing when we came out. And he didn't know where he was! Because he was fasting you know! So when we came out these officers said that, ‛See, this is religion.“ Then they told me the story that Tsar had an idea that everybody has got a religion, why not Russia also should have some religion. So they sent for the Catholic people to come down and tell them about Catholicism. So the Catholics came, that time there was only Catholicism, so they came and they said, ‛Alright, Catholicism is very simple that you can drink, do what you like, only thing, you cannot marry again.“ Tsar said, ‛This won't work out in Russia, is difficult, not for us.“ So he said, ‛Alright, now let's have another one.“ So they sent for the muslims, Islam. So the Muslims came in and they said that, ‛You can marry any number of wives, doesn't matter, but you can't drink.“ They said, ‛This won't suit us!“ So they had another third religion that was this [that was] supposed to be orthodox. Orthodox religion, the most liberal one! Was this orthodox, Greek religion and they said, ‛Oh, you can drink and you can have as many wives as you like as long as you give us sufficient money.“ Only their interest was money. They said, ‛This is alright, very good religion! We have to give them money and only thing they have to do is to call us religious so that we are religious people; nobody should say that they have no religion!“ That's how the religion came into this country, Russia. And with this kind of a religion, who is going to believe in it? It’s correct! After coming to Sahaja Yoga you can see that all these so-called religious bodies have ruined the name of religion completely. All those people, who talked of religion this, that, and one theory to another theory, one incarnation to another incarnation they used, have ended up into a nonsensical stuff. And everybody is seeing so clearly now that it does not give you any, any idea whatsoever as to what is God, as to the experience of God.

So this religion that was established, was to give balance to people, has made them very imbalanced. They are fanatics, every one! Protestants, as I told you, are the greatest fanatics because they are very subtle and they are very sophisticated, so nobody can't find out their fanatic ideas.

With this, now we have Sahaja Yoga, and Sahaja Yoga has given you Realisation, the real experience of the Divine. For the first time now you can feel that you are the Spirit, you can feel the powers of Spirit. There are so many ways, in these 12 years you must have seen, that you should be convinced that there is an All-pervading Power, which is active, which is helping you, through which you have come up to this stage and that It has empowered you to do miraculous things. We have got My photographs to give you a proof. The other day someone took a photograph in Jordan at the time of Sahastrar puja thinking that, ‛Mother give a bandhan to Jordan.“ And the photograph has got the light, the bandhan light in it! So the Unconscious is working, very strongly, and It is trying to help people to understand God's ways, so we cannot change His ways, His styles, His rituals, His methods. That's why I’m here to tell you, I am like the mouthpiece of the Unconscious to tell you what is to be done, what is right, what is wrong, what is not to be done.

Now, in this religion, you yourself are awakened into religion yourself! You become sensitive to religion yourself! The coding and everything is within yourself. You have to yourself feel it: How you feel vibrations? When you feel vibrations? How do you lose vibrations? What happens? All those things are just within yourself. Of course, after some time, we might be able to say what behavioural changes one should take. But you can find out yourself, if you want to find out — what is right and what is wrong and what is to be done to keep up the vibrations.

But vibrations are, [in] one way, extremely charitable, very charitable things. Even if you do little wrong they may not disappear that moment, but you’ll get a feeling within yourself that this wrong. After some time you’ll find, it will show, that you have no vibrations and you wouldn’t know that you have no vibrations! So the first principle of sahaj dharma is, or what you call Vishwa Nirmala Dharma, is that you should be able to keep up your vibrations going as they are, or increase them or improve on their sensitivity. The more sensitive you are the better you are. If the sensitivity is lacking then one must say that Sahaja Yoga has failed in you, so far, and you have to work it out.

But the problem of human being is very different, that is that, when they’re ascending, when they are trying to get out of the bhavasagara, there are so many human things which are with them, and those things try to bring them down again, back to the place from where they started. For example, say, you are a person, who has had no power at all in life and also you are a person, who has enjoyed some powers — both are just the same; both are power drunk or power hungry or whatever you may call them. A starving is a same as a man who aspires for food all the time — both are starving. In the same way, the one, who aspires for power in both ways is the same [type of] person. When he comes to Sahaja Yoga, instead of becoming humble and understanding that there’s something lacking in me, myself, he starts forming groups. He starts saying, ‛Alright, this is not good, this fellow is not good, you better correct yourself, you do that, you do this,“ in others. He does not want to become a perfect person himself. The one, who has attention towards anything like that or falls into any group whatsoever, goes into trouble and I immediately know, from his face, there’s something wrong with this person.

So to form into groups itself is a sign of our deterioration. Like in our cells in the body now, say, for example, there are blood cells which are flowing: suddenly, when they are harmed or sick or anything, they coagulate together and it forms a lumpish thing in it. So when you are moving you are free; then one must understand that you are healthy. But as soon as there’s a barrier made that, ‛This man is bad, this woman is bad,“ so, now a barrier exists. The whole group forms. One group here and one group there and one group there. But as Sahaj Yoga is complete discretion, which is to be developed by the people who practice it — discretion — they have to also know that there are some people who are not to be dealt with, to be discarded — individually. Like there's somebody, one person, ‘X’ person is there, who is caught up very much and he's got lots of badhas, this, that. Now if he’s badhic or anything, everybody must individually drop him. Not to discuss him or talk about him collectively but just drop him — if they were sensitive. If you are sensitive, immediately you know this person has a badha. Nobody will go close to him. But invariably I’ve seen in groups, when we meet, always five bhoots, if there are, they will all sit together. Immediately you know the bhoot is there — localised. And the five good people will never sit together. That means we are not yet developed ourselves, individually, within ourselves.

So, the first attitude to develop this dharma within us…the dharma here means the one that is going to develop in our central nervous system. Our own new dimension we have to develop within ourselves. In a deeper way it is what we call the subtler being that is within us. Is to be awakened [so] that it lies in the nerves we can say, itself, in the central nervous system. To develop that we have not worked out, why? Because our attention is still outside. We are worried about another person, we are worried about third person, we are worried about this, ‛He shouldn't say this“, ‛he shouldn't do.“

But the person who is really trying to improve himself will always go inward. Now supposing this is a person, who has a badha, he'll just shun that person, will be away from that person, will not say anything collectively, will not discuss it, will not talk about it, just finish it. ‛[He’s] not alright.“ But then you may say, ‛Mother, then at least 50% Sahaja yogis would be like that.“ I don't think so. If you can scan it out yourself, you'll find there are about 4 or 5 like that who are badhics — which I know — the rest of you are alright. But when you come in contact with them, then you get it because you have not developed that powerful personality within you. And that's how I get sick myself, because you are within myself. So all of you must individually look after yourself, so collectively, that’s me, I am looked after. But we do not look after ourselves that's the main point is. There are so many methods by which we can just become perfect. How much time do we spend in that?

Now, in the ashrams whatever I have heard about England: that it’s the greatest place where one can become absolutely lost! If you want to lose your vibration, go to an English ashram! Especially in London. The vibrations in the ashram are the worst of all. Can you imagine such a thing? I mean. Why it happens? One lazybones comes in the ashram. He's got a bhoot in him. He’s a lazy person. Normally a person should be active! So what he does? He does not want to get up in the morning. Another one tries to follow him. How are you going to ascend? Let us think about this. This lecture should not be just listened to, is to be practiced, is to be understood, you have to be serious about it. How are we going to ascend? Are we going to ascend by reading the book ‘Ascent’ or by listening to Mother's tapes, which is very interesting? How are we going to improve? By taking the medicine. What is the medicine? Is nothing but meditation itself is the medicine. Now when do you do meditation? You have to do meditation in the morning time; that’s the best time, because you are not yet busy. Early in the morning you get up and do it. But you just can't get up! ‛I can't get up.“ Why not? That day you just don't eat your food the whole day. Next day you'll get up!

You have to treat your body in such a way that it becomes your slave. You have to use this body for enslavement, and not this body for your enslavement, your Spirit's enslavement. So if you could just understand that the only way to ascend is through meditation and not through all kinds of politics talking, jabbering, mental feats — nothing of the kind!

But I have seen people, they cannot steadily do it, what we call ‘satatya’ (?????? — constancy) means ‘consistently’. They will do it today and do it tomorrow. But in the ashram it should be a rule! Every morning there should be some nice music to be played. In India the radio starts at about 6 o’clock, in Bombay. I don't know if you have seen to that? And six o'clock the first thing is the one, what we call the awakening of the gods, Bhupali (raga) they start it. They start singing that. From 6 to 8 nothing but bhajans and God's songs are there, nothing else. The whole of Bombay has to listen to that, there's nothing else, no news. So, early in the morning when you get up, you can start with some sort of a conch or anything that you want to, or with the bells or maybe what we call the ghanta that thing we have like that. Or you can start with a bhajan so that everybody gets up. Go and have your baths. Keep the room hot. Come and sit down for your meditation.

Now those, who are householders, could be even worse than this because that's also another, ‛my house, my child, my family.“ This ‘my’ business. I have to struggle through all this, because everybody [says] ‛I am marrying this person,“ ‛Now that person is running away, so I have to marry another person.“ ‛That is about to run, then I have to get the third!“ Problem of the children. Then, ‛how to get the children?“ All the time this problem is there. Everybody is bothering me with this problem: ‛What to do with the wife? Where to keep her? She’s so horrid!“ This, that and everything! Now all these problems can be solved on one point, if you are a strong person, you can solve the problem like that.

So, instead of wasting your energy in solving these side matters why not you become something great yourself and get the problem solved by itself? It's logical. But what I have seen about people is this, that they do not understand their own value and worth.

Now as I have said, this is Shiva's country, Sadashiva's country, is the Kailasha itself. And where you are born, where you are Sahaja yogis — what is your position here? Into what position have you come? Where are you? Think of your position in the land of Sadashiva.

The other day only I told them that in the land of Sadashiva, ganas are there. And as the Americans got the idea of The Smurfs, they are the ganas. You won't find any Smurf sitting down, he is so active. Not one Smurf you’ll find who is sitting down. Either he'll be a barber or he'll be a washerman or he'll be a beginner, or he'll be a fiddler or he'll be some thing doing! So to become that you have to be active in your body. The activity in the body has to come. But from where to get the energy for the activity? From the Spirit. And if you do not meditate how will you get to that? You just tell me — is there any way out? This is the basic problem that people do not have regular habits. They do not. They are very hectic people, extremely hectic. In the West people are extremely hectic. Indians are that way quite regularised because of a very strong parenthood. Parents themselves are sensible and regular. We have to be regular too. There are no regular habits: somebody will get up at 6 o'clock, somebody will get up at 9 o'clock, somebody will get up at 10 o'clock. And if you are to wake up an Englishman, they say, ‛Use a bargepole!“ Of course, that’s the greatest sin! That's the greatest sin! But even if you have to commit the sin — use a bargepole! So, sleep is such an important thing for them and they are always tired.

Now why this tiredness comes in, we must understand, is due to heart. Because the heart is weak that's why you become tired. If you raise the heart you'll be alright. So, one by one we see why. Why is it, heart weak? Because we have done anti-God things. We have done things which we should not have done, so our heart is weak. They are always tired and they are not ashamed of saying, ‛I am tired!“ Anybody who listens to the television will be surprised, they'll have, ‛Huuuhhh!“ Within five minutes at least you must hear 6, 7 times ‛Huuuhhh!“ coming out. Young people! They'll come and sit on the chair ‛Huuuhhh!“. First I used to think it is a fashion, that you must do like this, otherwise you are not impressive. Because, you know, the fashions here to impress people are so funny!  I don't understand, I thought it was a fashion. But why you are tired? Let’s see why are you tired? Your heart, heart is catching. Why is heart catching? In the very subtlest of subtlest, is that you have done anti-God things. Now how do you cure that? Now let Me have answers.

Vicki Halperin: We will put You, Mother, in our heart.

Shri Mataji: Good idea. You have to put Me in your heart. Now see how the cosmos of the whole Sahaja Yoga system since long has been built in, in you. Heart is the most important part, from [which] everything circulates. This heart is the one, when it fails, you are dead, no more there. The Spirit resides in the heart, alright. Now you are made like this even in your head that the heart centre comes up exactly on the brahmarandhra, where it has to break. So, if your heart is weak, you cannot pierce through. So, putting Me in your heart and raising Me to your Sahastrara, that's the best way you can cure your heart. But that's not so! You also put some theological concepts on that. I've seen people do. So, ‛Mother, I put You in my heart, I love You very much,“ this, that, everything. But I see there's not Mother there at all! Just lip service! ‛I'm putting You in my heart, of course you are there!“ But where am I? I try to find. I can't see Myself there. No, I am not there. So from where do I see you? Through your eyes. If I am there I can see through your eyes, I can penetrate up to that. Such eyes are very different. Your eyes have to change through your heart. There's no deception in between. If your heart changes your eyes will change. You don't have to tell Me. I know that. So this, ‛I love You,“  Why? ‛Because I wanted to have a job,“ finished! ‛I love You Mother, because I thought my marriage problem will be solved.“ ‛I give You this, because I’ll get money!“ ‛I pray for you, because I must have a child,“ or something like that. It's so much below.

But the state [you] must reach, where ‛I just love You for nothing at all. Just love You because I enjoy it. I enjoy that love for my own enjoyment. Just for my own enjoyment I love You. Not even for the ascent or anything but I just enjoy that love within myself. For nothing at all, just for myself I love You.“

As long as you live on relative terminology you cannot work it out. Now, ‛Why do I live in the ashram? It's cheap to live there, it's easy, children are looked after you know, quite nice, you are safe. Mother also comes sometimes. If you are sick She'll look after us, so She treats us. Otherwise, I leave it to Mother to do everything.“ Still you are in duality. You have to just love Me because you enjoy it. Otherwise, I’m not asking you to love Me am I? How can you ask anyone, ‛You, love me! Come along!“ And you put a pistol, ‛Come along, love me!“ Can you do it? You can't. You can demand money, you can demand anything, but can you say, ‛Alright, now hands up, give me your love!“? So it cannot be forced.

So the depth of the heart must be brought in. Now heart is covered with funny ideas. The thought, which is in the mind, as we say. Actually the thoughts are covering the brain and those thoughts ultimately cover the heart. I have told you what is the connection between heart and the brain is. Now, so if these thoughts are covering our heart, how can we open out? For example, a thought is there that, ‛I love Mother, because She has to sell my house.“ Alright, now the house doesn't sell. ‛How is it? Mother I said it will be sold, then why is it not sold?“ This is not the level of Divine Love. You are going to love the Divine. It has to be pure love of simple purity. And that depth you all have, that's the special thing you have. All of you have that within you, that heart within you. If you understand this very small thing is actually the seed of all the mantras.

Now when you say that you love Me very much, I do not think you do love. But you ask yourselves, ‛Do I really love Mother?“ Now face [it]. ‛No, I do not.“ ‛Still there are so many other foolish ideas into my head. Still I am an intellectual, still I'm seeing Mother from an intellectual point of view or from an emotional side.“It's a state, it's a state of nirananda, is a state. And such a person is never challenged and, even if he is challenged, is never affected. Such a person suddenly stands out and you see a lotus before your eyes.

Now you are sitting in the city which is governed by Sadashiva. Here you are born. You are all the great Spirits who are born [here]. Now you are the ones who have to give fragrance to the whole world. It has nothing to do with any other thing like status, money, position, nothing. What was the status of Christ? He was a carpenter's son. How much did he earn? Nothing. Did He go to any university? Never. Did He study any Greek mythology or something like that? Never. Did He bother His head about libraries? Never. But, He was Christ. In the same way, it does not matter to what level you go, to what extent you go in your material side, it is your spiritual side which is important. And for that it is important you must face it. That's only possible in meditation. Honestly to face it! But the trouble is as soon as Mother gives the lecture, it's finished there. Nobody thinks…. (a baby is crying) what has happened? Why are you crying? You want to go to mummy? Don’t cry, don’t cry! Mummy is there. Don’t cry, don’t cry, it’s alright.

Now, as I said, 12 years of My tapasya is over. I have really worked very hard, I must say. England is not easy, and London is even worse. And you get terrible pain from your liver it starts moving towards your heart, just like a dagger, in this country. The liver is bad, the heart is dark. It's not easy to live here. Moreover I have put all you in My heart and you are circulating in My body [so] you have to be kind to Me. The level has to be much better. But as soon as somebody achieves some level, people start criticising him, saying things against that person, forming groups, forming things.

As I told you before, you are also very fortunate that I am here in England. I have spent much more time than I have spent anywhere else. And still I cannot say definitely about anyone of you, I mean of course some of them are perfect, but otherwise, that any day you'll become [like] John Gilpin (riding the horse of ego). You can't say. Suddenly I find somebody is just suddenly jumping on a horse. So this character that we have within us, of becoming John Gilpin must be watched. Humility is needed. We have to be humble and see within ourselves:  ‛Why do we become John Gilpins suddenly? What happens to us?“ This is a very, very common character. The example I’ll give [you]: I went to a hotel with my husband, stayed overnight. It was in England and next morning, I think there was a wedding or something or whatever it was. And two ladies, young girls, I would say about 25 years of age, wearing a nice dress and a hat and all that, talking to their boyfriends, who were also very dandily dressed, talking as if they were some sort of dukes or duchesses or something like that talking so big with their hats and this and that. My husband looked at Me, ‛By the way don’t use spectacle, these are the girls, who come to clean in our office.“ I said, ‛Really? Look at them! Just putting the hat, they feel they have become duchess or what?“ And as soon as they saw him, they became very peevish. (laughter) But I was very amazed that how could they suddenly take up a role of a some sort of royal family stuff, you know, the way they were walking! (laughter) And we couldn't help laughing both of us, but, I mean, he laughed much more because he said, ‛I can’t believe it they are…“ and he could not believe it for a while, but when they became peevish, the reaction, their reaction really proved that they have just become a duchess. They had some hats on. If they wear a hat and talk big — finished — now they are big. In the same [way] in spirituality: just because you have been to Sahaja Yoga — finished — then now you are a yogi of Yogeshwara, more than Shri Krishna, yourself. So one thing is this John Gilpin business, which is stupid, which makes a mockery out of ourselves. There are stories and stories I can tell you of this mockery: how ego makes you a stupid fool.

So this is biggest hurdle I think we have, here, is the ego. But then you tell somebody they’ll say, ‛It was my ego. It did it!“ as if the ego hangs somewhere like a monkey, and the monkey came and did the job and again went back on its hanging mood! (laughter) Otherwise, ‛It’s my bhoot which did it!“ (laughter) But when do you do something? Why should we deceive ourselves? This is a very serious type of deception of ourselves. Why? We are sahaja yogis, we are born in the Sadashiva's land; why not we be that beautiful being which is truthful, which is real, which is within us, which is the Spirit?

So the greatest hurdle is of our ego. Which can be shown in many ways. Because you see your reflection there. The first is, as I told you, wearing a hat: means then the upper-lip goes up suddenly (a reference to ‘stiff upper lip’ of British). I think the hat sucks [it] in I think! (laughter) Then they start saying sentences which are funny! I told you about, we had in our family a person, who had epilepsy, and he was a mentally-off fellow! And sometimes he used to get into ego-trip. Then he would wear very good socks and he would polish his shoes nicely, shine them, wear a nice shoes, wear a good suit, maybe three-piece or something, and sit down on the bridge of our house where we had a, sort of, an entrance to the gate and would sit there. And he would call someone, ‛I say big Bott,“ ‛I say, big Bott,“ ‛I say, big Bott“ I mean in English he knew only, ‛big Bott“. So he thought he was, he’s, an Englishman now! He used to call everyone like this. And we would wonder why does he do like that? What is the thing that makes him say these words like, ‛I say, big Bott“? He had seen some English people talking like that. So he used to call all the people going on the road like this, ‛I say big Bott,“ ‛I say, big Bott“. So then in our family, if somebody becomes John Gilpin, we say he’s become big Bott.

So this, ‘big Bott’ business is horrid. Should be avoided completely.

But the second thing that happens to us is very good, is when we do not, I mean if you are sophisticated, well-educated, then it is not ‛big Bott“, it is ‛bot bit“. Then we say sarcastic things! Say something in a sarcastic way, never in a direct way. In a sarcastic way we enjoy. I mean, you see on the television you get really surprised how people talk to each other sarcastically. ‛So what, Hoh, hoh, hoh, hoh!“ goes on. And such sarcasm. And according to them sarcasm perhaps is the intense intelligence or something like that. I don't know, whatever it is certified, as what. But whatever may be the certificate for it, it’s the most gruesome act.

These days we do not kill people, do we? If we kill, we'll be handcuffed. We do not beat children, we do not beat anyone, because we’ll be handcuffed. But to say a sarcastic thing is in modern times the most gruesome act which is not punishable under law. But not under the law of Vishwa Nirmala Dharma. This sarcasm is the essence of English character. Take it from Me. Never say the things straightforward. And that's the sign of intelligence and been to a big training of it.

First of all they’ll not say anything they will sulk, keep quiet. Not to say anything. But if they say, they must say like this. Something that is sort of a stagnated, dirty, filthy water that smells. They'll not open their mouth, but once they open their mouth, God save you! God knows what will come out of that mouth, maybe some snakes, maybe some scorpions. And nobody feels hurt about it! That's the best part of it. So this is one thing one has to guard against — our Vishuddhi — not to use sarcasm. Comes from left Vishuddhi very much. [Not] at all! Because that's against Me. I'm never sarcastic with you, am I? I tell you straightforward on your face, ‛You have a bhoot on your head that's all.“ Or if you have ego I said, ‛It's ego.“ Why be sarcastic? So we have to learn how to be straightforward and sweet.

Let's first decide today we are going to say nice things to others. But no! Nice things will be like this. If somebody supposing is a person, who, say, is a dwarf. So to say nice things, they will say, ‛Oh what a tall man is coming!“ Or is there's a blind man coming, they will say something, ‛Oh what eyes, beautiful!“ So they start from physical to mental level to anything. They go on describing a person. Why do you describe others? Why don't you describe yourself? The whole energy’s spent in describing others. What about yourself? So this is another character that we have; we hurt others through our tongues.

This tongue is meant for giving the taste of Divine to others. To say things that will make people feel comforted. For saying mantras. See, if you go on telling lies, your mantras will never be fruitful, never activate. But if you are sarcastic, they will never act. Say it thousand times, say it two thousand times, say it million times. To make your mantras effective you should stop talking in that manner. If you have to talk, talk something that will be pleasing to another person. Now somebody might say, ‛Then if you say pleasing, it may not be the truth“, alright, then don't say it — not necessary to say. Just keep quiet. But you decide now to turn your head upside down, which is all the time upside down already, so you put it right, now, and say that, within yourself that, ‛Now no more of harshness from my tongue will flow,“ because it will never give you the power of mantras. Mantra powers are lost. If you have to say something, say it pleasingly. Always. Moreover if you have to correct someone, if you are in a position, if you are the leader, if you have to say. Also say it in such a way that you neutralise it. But no sarcasm at all! This is one of the very big snags we have on our Vishuddhi.

Now what is the other snag we have, let us see. I'm talking to you, because just now I'm a Britisher Myself. The another snag I find is saving pounds, saving labour, saving everything else but your Spirit. Like I'll tell you, if you want to find an Englishman, that's what Indian Sahaja yogis tell Me, very easy to find out an Englishman. You ask somebody to close the window; everybody will try to do it except for the Englishman, who’ll be sitting down, he’ll never get up; saving labour. And if you tell any work to an Englishman, then he’ll stare at you like this; like this, ‛How dare you tell me [to] work?“

As it is, I must tell you about Australians: I used to think they are very healthy people. They are hardworking, no doubt, they are very hardworking they come forward. But I went there and we had decided to cook food for them in two centres for about, once for about 250 and again about 500 people. I mean, I go in to such ideas! So, in the first place, all the boys, who came to help me, were all Indians. They were the ones, Who were lifting the thing and all that. I said, ‛Tell these boys also, they are Australians, after all they have eaten so much a meat, they must be having good muscles, why are you doing it?“ They said, ‛No, they are delicate people Mother, don't tell them.“ I said ‛delicate? How?“ ‛They are very delicate, though they eat meat they are very delicate, we know how to do, let us do it.“ And both the places the same people acted! You were there? Last time?

Yogi: No Mother, no.

Shri Mataji: Who was there in Australia? Anybody?

Yogini: I was there Mother.

Shri Mataji: You were there? Isn’t it?

Yogini: Yes Mother.

Isn’t it? They were all Indians, who were working there, mainly. Isn't it true?

Yogi: Yes true.

Shri Mataji: Because they said that, ‛They are delicate. At the slightest thing their waist line will go out.“ (laughter) ‛They can't lift these big things. They just can’t!“ And they would not allow, they said, ‛No, no let us do it. We know they are delicate people.“ I was really surprised that for Australians there were thinking like that. Then what about English? Because of avoiding labour, saving yourself from labour, you have become weak people. If you don't use one finger, you don't work, that will become a weak finger, always. Say, if your hand is in plaster for say, say about a week or two weeks — you take out the hand out of the plaster, the hand cannot hold itself. It becomes weak. Isn't it doctor? It becomes weak, if you don't use your hand, it becomes weak. If you don't use your body, your body becomes weak. If you laze out, if you become lazy, you cannot do any work, you don't want to do any work, all your muscles will become useless. Till the age of at least sixty years you have to use your body very much more than what you are using.

So now they will do jogging. They'll do jogging. After jogging it's an out of proportion thing that they do. They are so exhausted. But do your exercises, or whatever it is, in normal way. But, actually, do your work! But they cannot. They cannot get up fast, they (Americans) can, ‛I'll get it.“ Americans, that way Americans, if you tell them, they’ll say ‛I'll get it.“ Telephone comes, ‛I'll get it,“ ten persons will run and you’ll know they are all Americans! That’s why they have improved. They are so industrious. Very industrious people. Japanese are extremely industrious. They had the problem, because the cars could not move out in the streets, were all full with the cars. So they wanted to build these flyovers and within one year, within one year, within, they built the flyovers all over Tokyo, all over Tokyo, which is a very large city. These small, little things, you know, they walk like this. Little, little things with little, little legs. (laughter) Hiroshima, which was bombed, if you go and see that place, you won't believe it was bombed! Except for the museum. And they have kept one building to show that this is the place that was bombed. Otherwise you won't believe that, that was Hiroshima! Same with Nagasaki, I have seen it Myself with both. I mean I can't imagine how these people have worked it out! So industrious! So industrious!

So one is lethargy. Krishna has said…the first thing he’s put it, the worst of all is lethargy. To Him the worst thing that can happen to human being is lethargy. That is, ‛Alasyo bijayate“. everything comes out of alasya — laziness. Keep active! Do some work!

But in Indian life, I tell you, even My mother was like that, at anyone, if you are standing, ‛Why are you standing?“, if you are sitting, ‛Why are you sitting?“, if you are walking, ‛Where are you walking?“ You should be doing something all the time. You haven't seen anyone in India. You have seen villages — even small children are doing something. Such a hot country. In the day they might have a little siesta. It's a very, very hot country. But all otherwise, they are working. That's what, only the industriousness will help you and will keep your mind out of mischief.

Everything comes after you have decided not to be lethargic. Tell your mind not to be lethargic. Lethargic minds brings you all these nonsensical ideas. For that you must have regular habits, which you do not have. I'm told that those who have been to colleges and universities have been through some regular this thing or to some good schools. But once they went to drugs everything is washed off. So drugs is one thing that kills all your discipline, your proper training of satatya, of consistency. So to overcome that, you must make it a routineous (sic) thing, certain thing. Absolutely  routineous. [Then] you’ll get over it. I mean, it should be; because routine also helps you in one way that you do not waste much energy about, say for example, I know I have to give five strokes to My hair just to make it alright, so I give five strokes, finished. One, two, three, four, five, done. But supposing I say, ‛No, sometimes five, sometimes eight, sometimes seven,“ then I waste My time in brushing my hair. So five strokes for the hair is alright. One wash, for one wash, three times just to wash it off. If you can fix up things like that, you'll be surprised you'll be saving lot of time. So this is another thing we do not have is a definite number of things we have to do. I’ll tell you the story of Gandhiji, which you will be surprised. Such a great man like him. To go to his bathroom, so-called hut of his bathroom was there. In between his hut and that hut, was, there were, he had put, seven stones. I don't why he had put them seven. Seven stones one after another. While going there he used to count them, seven, coming back he used to count them, seven. Alright. And somebody once put one more there. Because thinking they are too far away from each other, whatever it is. Immediately he said ‛Why the eighth one? Remove it!“ Again he put seven! I mean, you would say such a great man to waste energy on counting these stones. Was that he was saving his time: ‛one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, I'm there. Then I do next thing then.“

So as far as this material world is concerned, you have to be like a machine. As far as the spiritual life is concerned, you have to be like an ocean. Or like the energy. The machine has to be fixed and the energy then flows better. Do you see the two things? The ocean of energy is at work and the machine is perfect because it has consistent things. Supposing now the machine is made of two wires here: supposing you suddenly take out one, it won't work! All these are fixed things as you understand machines very well. And all these fixed things can give you a lot of saving of time. While we try to save time, ‛I have no time.“ Why? ‛Because I was standing before the mirror for about one hour.“ Meditation we have no time. Standing before a mirror for one hour! ‛What were you doing before the mirror?“ ‛Trying to comb my hair,“ For one hour!

So where you spend so much time [it] could be saved, so save time. For that you must know your priorities and you must know your importance, that saving time means saving time for our ascent. But in our daily life we do that, supposing there’s, say, there's a man, who has to manage some aeroplanes, what does he do? He takes up his time in dressing up, sometimes if he’s late, he just gets up, hurries up, somehow or other gets into his cab or car whatever it is, takes the fastest run and jumps to the aeroplane, because he has to carry the aeroplane, that’s his job. So his priority is not how many times he stands before the mirror, combs his hair, but the priority is he must get to the aeroplane. That's what should be with us also that: how much time do we take to do all these nonsensical things? And how much time for the right things?

So priorities have to change and then you will be surprised, you will have lots of time to do many things. What is your priority? That is to be decided. And in your wisdom you must know your priority is your ascent because this chance you are never going to get [again]. This a special chance, specially for you, specially you are going to get it, and you have every possibility of going very high in case you put your priorities right.

So what is your priority? Firstly. Saving time, now saving money. I have seen people, I shouldn't say, but having horrible experiences I've had about people how they waste their money. We have been going to India many a times, and every time people come, they come just like traders. And once it happened like this, to this extent it went, that in Delhi I had reserved lot of area for my chandeliers to come with the Air India. I had paid for it, and I told them that let them come with the Sahaja yogis. Because they can carry in the hand, I don't want it to be thrown away by your people if I send it. They said, ‛Alright we’ll put them with the Sahaja yogis.“ But I didn't tell them chandeliers or anything, but my things. The Sahaja yogis had so much of weight that they covered all my area, everything, and still there was overweight, which was excused by Air India. And all My chandeliers were left there high and dry on the airport, nobody to even to pick them up. And they came here with all these loaded things; I don't know where it has disappeared all the things that they brought from there. This is one of the things. But this, many a times has happened, things like that.

So where do you save your money? Why can't you save your money? I have seen two persons like that, I’ll say, one person who lived in my house. He had food, he had shelter, he had everything with him. He didn't have to spend anything. I was also paying him some money. He’s never had money all his life. There's another one who came and stayed, who was same way. I never paid a money to him, he always had money with him. He saved. I said, ‛How do you save?“ He said, ‛Mother, where do I spend? You spend for me, I eat my food here, I have everything, I don't have to pay rent, nothing, I'm very nicely placed here. Where do I spend all the money that comes to me as a dole becomes a sort of a saving for me?“ One person never had money and another person saved lot of money. What is the reason for that? Again the priorities.

So these bad habits that you have had before for which you are spending money and all that, must be saved. Now, alright, when we travel of course we must pay for your travelling and staying and food and all that, that's a different point. But you must know we are going to have very big problems of our own projects we are going to have. I mean, we will need money for that. I'm not going to ask you people, but I know money will come to Me. But first of all you don't even have money at all, because there's no accounting, there's no proper understanding as to how much you have, how much to spend, where to spend, what to do. And the money is just spent away like that.

You must make a compartment of that money also, because as a Mother I must tell you everything. See now, you give Me money supposing for something, I make a compartment. You gave Me money in puja, I made a compartment, this is puja money. Alright, now this I have decided on My own, I need not do, but I've decided that I'll buy silver out of it for you people because silver is there and all this silver that I gave you and also more I have to give you, because you can't have puja with a plastic, alright, I have to give that silver. So that puja money can be used. So I have a compartment, I've written it down. Each and every pai (paisa) I have written it down. I have made a compartment, this one for this one for this one for this one. But you are so haphazard! You will never have money, because God knows where you spend your money!

So to understand that you must have proper priorities, you have to do away with things, which are not needed. Like I know of one Sahaja yogi, who used to spend lot of money, and I said, ‛Where do you spend your money?“ He was very fond of Indian food, he used to go to Indian restaurant every day. Can you imagine? One day it happened that we went to that Indian restaurant, and the fellow recognised that fellow, because he was driving us and, ‛Oh, how are you here today?“ he said, ‛Why, you didn't come for the last five days?“ I said, ‛Do you mean he comes here every day?“ He said, ‛Yes, practically.“ We can't afford to go to Indian restaurant. Every month maybe once in a while we have to take some guests and all that and CP gets money for that. I don't know how you can go to an Indian restaurant, eat food in the restaurant.

So, priorities are such that we waste our money here, there, so we have no money. Then we try save money: we become ridiculous sometimes about certain things, which are something I can't believe that Sahaja yogis could be like that. So how can, they all are like beggars. Then how can beggars be generous, can they be generous? They cannot. When you go to India, how Indians look after you. You have seen that. They work so hard. You go to somebody's house. They'll give there best that they have in the house to eat. Last time, when it was the wedding thing — Warren is another great, what should I say, a kingly person; he wanted to give very expensive presents to the people, who got married. Very expensive. Amounting to about 2000 rupees each, about. So, and also the hand things and all that would have been about 25,000. I mean 2,500. So I told Warren, I said, ‛Warren, it's going to be too much,“ alright, so I took away 600 part out of it. 600 I paid each. Each person who got married I've paid 600 for each of them. He asked all the Sahaja yogis, who were there to pay 108 rupees, means?8. For 54 marriages one rupee each. On that also I had complaints when I came to London! And Indian Sahaja yogis on their own collected and gave 10,000 rupees to cover up the expenses. What is 108? And then they grudged! That's the worst part of it! When I came back, they grudged about it. I just…you see, from sublime to ridiculous I just felt — what am I to say? They sent a big delegation! ‛Oh, that we were lynched!“ and this and that. So what, are you going to give 1p (?0.01) to them or what? And if you are going for a wedding, won't you give some present to them? Why? Because you have to buy things for somebody who is a relations of relations of relations of relations. What is the need to oblige such a distant personality? What is your relationship? Your relationship is with Sahaja yogis. They are your brothers and sisters. Really they are your own, whom you should give presents at least on their wedding day, if not otherwise. I don't know otherwise if Sahaja yogis give to anyone. But ‛My uncle's mother's brother's somebody's somebody's somebody, he has asked me to buy this for him. So I’m taking.“

So again the priorities are to be changed. Who are your brothers and who are your sisters? Who is your family, who is your Mother? It's a matriarchal society. We have a Mother and we have Her children and we are all related to each other. Others are all others; we are one. But I have seen, even in discussions, people have told Me, that Sahaja yogis will take the side of the new Sahaja yogis and fight. You all should support each other instead of your taking the side of somebody third person coming in. Suddenly you get attached to that person, why? So this is one of the special characteristics, if we have got, we should try to understand. If you cannot go, don't go. But if you go then you have to behave yourself. If you cannot afford, you should not do it. But if you can afford it, and if you have to go there, then go, but don't behave like beggars that when we come back here, what shocked Me that for these hundred and eight rupees I had to talk to people, I mean really it shocked Me completely! And I could pay that back, hundred and eight is not much, to all of you. But it was so and the discussion was about this. Alright, so one should not discuss this. For your information, you know your Mother has spent lot of money but I've never said that and no one knows how much I have spent. Even if you ask Gavin, he won't be able to say. Nobody. They know little bit here and little bit there and Warren knows little bit there and somebody knows here. But not to be said. When you spend something you are not to tell. Just to be done quietly, sweetly, beautifully. But here it is — little thing like that and to talk like that. I mean, I was really…you are saints, you know you are saints, you are great people, you are evolved people, you are religious leaders of tomorrow. What are you saying? What are you talking? Just think of that: what is your position in life?

So saving labour, saving money and last of all that we try to save everything for ourselves — selfishness. Tremendous selfishness and we don't see it sometimes. So please try to understand that all this material selfishness must end up into spiritual selfishness. If you are really selfish, then know the Self, which is the source of everything, if you are really sensibly selfish. Are you? Then know that Self. It gives you everything. And now you have opened the way, you have come inside, now you are there, you are sitting here. What more do you want? I don't understand.

So, there are some good people, I'm not saying there are not, there are many good people, but those who are not, bring forth all these things and they create, generate a situation. In such a thing, supposing in a discussion, somebody starts, you should just say, ‛Shut up! We are saints. We are not to talk these things.“ Say, if you meet some saints together, they are sitting down. Will they discuss these things? Will they discuss these things? Will they talk about these things? Think of it. You are saints. First of all know that you are all saints. Now, you are all saints now. What should you discuss? How we’ll spread Sahaja Yoga, how to talk about God, how to work it out, how to release our energies for God's work. This should be our main concern, isn't it?

I went to see Gagangan Maharaj. First of all, so he said, ‛I want to talk to You only.“  He didn't want to talk to Sahaja yogis. So he asked Me, ‛So You came on the earth, alright, but do You find us alright, are we capable enough to receive You?“ I mean, see the questions he asked Me. And then he says that, ‛What should we do on this earth to make You comfortable? What is needed to be done, because all the way You have taken your incarnation here?“ He talked to Me like this! I was amazed. Then he told his disciples, ‛Now this is the Goddess sitting before you. What are you doing? Do Her puja. You do my puja. What's the use of doing my puja? Do Her puja. Every bit of it.“ I was amazed at his reaction. That's what we have to understand that we are today…what’s it?

Yogi: No, I didn’t want the lamp to pass smoke if the oil burned out.

Shri Mataji: They are all burning alright?

Yogi: Can someone pass me some oil?

Shri Mataji: No, no, it’s burning alright. It will go on burning.

Yogi: it’s going to burn out.

Shri Mataji: Burn out? But still they are burning. Do you know how long it has been burning without oil? (laughter) I have seen it long time back!  (laughing)

So! Now we come to a point, where we understand ourselves from the ridiculous to the sublime point. That we should not oscillate anymore. Let us fix our sublime thoughts one after another. How we climb a mountain, fix one, then another sublime thought. Let some sublime thought come into your mind, ‛Oh that's such a beautiful thought, alright, fix that up.“ Like that. Then another sublime thought — you are a source of that! Now another sublime thought, ‛Aaahhh that's great! Hold on to that.“ Like that you climb up. Through sublimity, sublime. Not degrading thoughts. But immediately if there is some degrading argument or suggestion or some sort of…and a big argument will start [with] everybody sitting there. It's even worse than what I find about these BBC people now discussing on the table. Sometimes, can be very bad. So one has to understand that our priorities are going to be very different from all others. For them ridiculous is important, for us sublime is important. If anybody suggests anything like that, you should say, ‛No that's not sublime. No we can't have it. Can't talk with it. Just stop it!“ Let us see ourselves fully competing in achieving sublime within us.

You have assets, as I told you, that you are born in this country of Sadashiva. You are the heart of the Universe. That you are special people to be born here. You had people like William Blake before you. See the vibrations! Did he talk of anything ridiculous? Did he talk of anything nonsensical? Did he grudge about money? Did he say anything about it? How he stood up and how he said and what he propounded. He wants to create Jerusalem. Do we think like that? We have to create Jerusalem? Then how do we think all these ridiculous things: talking, gossiping and saying things and not working out through meditation our ascent.

I do not know how many more Sahaja yogis we are going to get. Because maybe that after this might get only donkeys, maybe I can't say. Let us hope we get better people, let us hope. But whatever you are, you are going to determine the image of the people who are going to come. That's why I wanted to talk to you, today specially, for this purpose that, we have to learn that so much is still to be done and Mother is going away now. If I go now, I'll come back of course for a short time but at the most two years more and then what? We have to work hard to come up. These two years we have to all work very hard. Specially in the ashrams. I've told you about chastity — that's the first part of it. And there should be absolutely brothers and sisters relationships among yourselves. Like a brother and sister never go and try to please each other, do they? I mean this thing called flirt, what you call flirting. That, do they do? And that should go on in the ashrams and things. It’s very wrong, I think it is very, very wrong to do that way. This is an ashram of sages, sages, who have taken their birth after ages. So sages must we worshipped like sages. You cannot dress up like a punk and become a sage. You cannot be like other people. A sage has a face, has an expression, has eyes, his whole gait is different from others. He has confidence, as well as compassion. We have to see those images in you.

Now so far is alright that we came to Sahaja Yoga for our gain. We are here now for the gain of others. We have gained whatever is possible, we don't want to gain any more. Now let us give this to others. For that we have to have an image, we have to dress up in that way. For example I was the other day telling the…I don't think it maybe too much for you people to believe that, but it’s a fact that it’s the brain that is upset here. Heart is of course is frozen, but brain is responsible. And I told them that every Saturday you must rub your head with so much of oil, nicely. Every Saturday, Sunday you wash it off. But on the whole, the system that existed before this, about twenty years back: all the English men used to have very nice combed hair, I mean, they never had fluffy hair or anything. But I think since this hairdressing started, people took to this kind of a thing, and it's very dishevelled and funny.

For a saint it should be properly dressed. There should be neatness about him. Untidiness is not a sign of a saint. You come and see My house, it's very big, I can not live with untidiness. If it's temporarily, you are somewhere is alright, but if you have to live somewhere you should be neat and tidy. But it is not so. I have seen people grudging; supposing you have gone to Brighton, Brighton people say they came here and went away even without even putting the beds right. When they come, the same Brighton people, when they come here to London, the London people tell Me that they came here, spoiled everything, did not put anything right and went away.

So the attitude of spoiling others' things and not your own is wrong. You have to change that. On the whole one has to understand the appearance, the living system is to be systematised, is to be systematised: so that you do not waste your energy in establishing that system — which is not so important. And the unsystematic, which is the energy, then works out better if you are systematised.

So a kind of neatness, a kind of a system in your life you should be there. I mean, I know of Gandhiji, he used to go out for a walk and people could put their watches right by the time he used to walk, the way he used to come and go and I…of course, you don't need to be slave of the watches, of course, that's not the point I'm saying, again I have to say the other thing, because you can go to the other extreme.

Is that. As in the whole the western mind is very self-opinionated, very self-opinionated, they don't want to learn anything from anyone, they think they are the best. Like they will go to somebody's house, «I don't like it», is not good. Or even an artist, say, say a person, who is well-educated in art, they have not seen the other world. So for them anything is a bit, sort of a funny thing. As I told you the other day, when I went to Brighton these people I talked to Brighton that in Brighton you have got such a beautiful piece of art where Rajput art and Mughal art is combined together in that royal pavilion outside, inside, they say, I have not seen the inside. But the description of that when I saw in the tourist book was that, ‛It is bizarre, it's absurd.“ [If] any one of them can make even one arch like that, then I can understand. But to criticise, why? Because you can't do it yourself. Because you can't do it, then it is ‘bizarre’, then it is bad. And this is much more in an English character than anywhere else. They make everybody look very low compared to them, always. Like some sahaja yoginis from abroad, I wanted them to come to England, to be married, they said, ‛Not in England Mother, we can't live there,“ because they all look down upon them. Italians are frightened of you people, if you ask Argentineans, they are frightened of you, Spanish are frightened of you. French, they say, ‛We are just the same as they are — can't go.“ Austrians don't want to come.

Though you may not have vibrations, though you may not be very good at realisation, you may not be anything, but you just put on a hat and you become «say Big Bot». You look down upon everyone, showing them down. The best way to exist in this world, have nothing, just try to show down a person, ‛You are no good.“

It's very surprising in Sahaja Yoga people say that about English people that they don't want to come to England, because everyone looks down upon you. You have developed a method of looking down upon others, but what do you do, what do you have. Let's [INAUDIBLE]. Come to the brass tacks as they say in America. Let's see. Can you sing as good as that [INAUDIBLE] that fellow played the other day, can you do it? Anyone of you in your generations? Can you build Taj Mahal, leave alone Ajanta? Can you make these rugs which Persians can make? What have you shown of your merit that you are boasting of? You cannot make the embroidery, the women here cannot. You cannot cook like us, can you? You cannot even make embroidery like the Spanish. You cannot make the furniture like the Italians, can you? What can you do? What is the art you have produced? Constable? Turner? Alright, I respect them as artists, but are they the topmost? Are they? Derek, you tell Me. You don't think so. Alright.

So now, what have we achieved so much that we think no end of ourselves? Put the question to yourselves first of all. That we look down upon everyone like that and think everybody is a stupid fool and you are the only cleverest person and even in Sahaja Yoga you do the same thing. It's not only ego, it's the stupidity, which tries to show off. So this is the worst thing that has happened to us, to our character, I tell you. We have no humility of any kind. Anybody, who does not know the job, will always behave like that. We don't know Sahaja Yoga, we don't know how to give Realisation, we cannot understand anything what's happening to another person, but we are great Sahaja yogis playing around: ‛I say Big Bot,“ again. That's the way, is a serious matter. We have no business to look down upon anybody else, but ourselves. What have we achieved?

In Sahaja Yoga I must admit, with all due respect to all of you: of all the people, of all the people, Australians are the best, I must say. I'm sorry to say, but it is so. Practically every Australian is much more sensitive, you can say. They were the criminals, sent as criminals, they are the children of criminals or whatever you may call them. Then the second are Austrians. French are the last, I agree. But there is competition between English and French, who is the last. They also look down upon everyone, the French.

So now for you, I know we are very fond of horse racing, so I'm putting you onto a race. You have to come up all of you. You can, because you have the greatest asset, which no one has: that you are born in England, where people like William Blake was born. It was Bhairava himself who took birth. He could not take birth anywhere else, but here He took birth — who described this house, who described My house, who has said everything about Sahaja Yoga. And He said that, ‛Men of God will become prophets and they will have powers to make others prophets.“ Have you become prophets now? The powers are not there. You can prophesise, [but] powers are not there because you are lost in all these frivolous, stupid, nonsensical things. Mantras are not working, your prophetic powers are not there. Your Kundalini powers are not there. Powers are not working. Weak, weak instrument. Make it alright! Systematise it.

You have the greatest advantage, I tell you, you have the greatest advantage and that's why I called this meeting now. I've been to this ashram so many times, I have never been to any such ashram, I've lived here the most of My time. Nowhere, nowhere in the world I've lived like this. Australia, I've been there only thrice, I think. And now things should not be taken for granted. Of course, spreading of Sahaja Yoga is important but ascent is also very important.

Let us now take a tapasya, a vow of tapasya, let us do it as a tapasya, as a penance, all of you. Whether you are in the ashram or in the house. Those, who are in the house are also lost. They don't drink, but they sleep. So what's the use? So now let us all take it up as a tapasya. And don't indulge into internal, nonsensical politics. There are others, who are doing it for you, don't you worry! Just develop your Self-awareness. And when I'm out in India, dedicate yourself. When I'm away from you — so-called ‘away’ — dedicate yourself to spread Sahaja Yoga and to ascend. Ascend in a way that constructs the whole Universe — construction. Construction power has to start from you. It's a chakra of construction, which has to work out through you. Anything that I have said should be taken just as an advice to you for your betterment. Work it out! Just listen to it and forget it. It's a medicine. So please listen to it again and again. Try to follow it in your own life, in your own life, not in others’! Mostly others think, ‛Oh She's talking of somebody else!“

There's a little hint, which Gavin wanted Me to tell that you should not play about, and they don't do normally, but still he wanted Me to tell you that the money part of it — you shouldn't try to cheat Me, in any way because we have seen some bad results very recently. So be careful on that. He wanted Me to tell you that one has to be careful not to cheat Me.

So may God bless you all.

Shri Mataji: So what's the problem of Cambridge? Where is Jim? What's the problem?

Yogi: Collectivity.

Shri Mataji: Now, you are the collective or your wife? Tell Me, who is the collective?

Yogi: All the people in Cambridge, Mother.

Shri Mataji: Derek (Lee), what do you have to say?

Shri Mataji: But why? What happened? It plays both ways. Alright, I say it plays both ways. Because you are the leader and they are there. It is your responsibility to see that you do not try to correct them all the time! Alright? Now it is your responsibility to see that you get yourselves corrected and see for yourselves that you are collective. It's the way you handle. The art of a leader is the way he handles situations.

You being an American (Jim) should know better how to handle. What's the problem? And I tell you, your wife, she still catches on?. Do you meditate every day?

Hilary: yes

Shri Mataji: Do you? Sure? It is there, still catching, I can feel it. Let us shift her from there, from Cambridge, to some other place, to get herself corrected. Isn't she catching very badly? You have a problem that you feel that you must take charge. All the wives of the leaders are not like that, but some of them are like that. Like madam Cahndbai? you can say, or Mrs. Mannar? or Mrs. Kennedy or we had another one, what's her name, this Indonesian one, horrible! They want to assert themselves as people, who should control. Is it true Derek? Not direct, indirect. You should try to correct her first. Because maybe it is having an effect on you Jim, possibly. Do you understand My point? She is catching. I can tell you. She is catching, ask anyone. Right heart she has, left heart. Anybody, who is sensitive, will say that. Now best thing is, you must see her vibrations first. You correct your wives, you correct your husbands in a way to see the vibrations. Otherwise, unless and until you go all out about it, you cannot work it out. They have a wife, they have a husband, all this nonsense is there. Just see to it that you clear it out completely. I think she should shift to some other ashram that would be better, and keep quiet. You are not in charge, he's in charge. It's a very common thing they are having this kind thing: the wife controlling. You know it happened in Australia, and we had to send the wife away to Stratford, where she changed. Should we send her to Stratford. You know how to cook or not as an American? Well it's alright. Send her somewhere. You must get alright because you influence him and the whole thing goes out.

Now Dennis, what's your problem? You try to find faults with him, do you? He tries to find faults with him. What's the problem? What is the problem, you have to tell Me.

Sahaja yogi: [inaudible].

Shri Mataji: Alright, what is it? I mean, I say such a straightforward thing I'm not such an intelligent woman, to say double-edged things. Now what is it, in what point? Let Me see.

Sahaja yogi: Some of us, I understand Mother that you say that we should win people through love and tolerance.

Shri Mataji: Alright.

Sahaja yogi: And others understand that we should make people see that there are certain standards that they have to live up to, and most people seem incompatible to us.

Shri Mataji: It can be understood very well. See, first supposing I give you a car and you say, ‛Mother, you have said I have to drive, so I start driving.“ I don't know how to drive, what's the use. See, people come to you in stages. Both the things are correct. First: ‛come on, come on, come on!“ Give them food, give them this, that, ‛come on, come on, come on.“ Be very nice. So-called protocol is to be done to them because they are newcomers. Alright? Need not immediately tell them the whole thing! Alright? Let them come.

When they are nicely settled down then you let them experience the joy, so they hanker after you.

Now I have said so many things today to you, which I didn't say before twelve years back. Say, if I had said twelve years back, do you think Gavin would have stuck onto Me? Ask Gavin, how they troubled Me, seven of them; all troubled Me such a lot. I was very patient and kind and affectionate and nice. And then, when they became Sahaja yogis, now I said, ‛Come along now.“ Then they started asking, ‛What should we do to improve ourselves Mother, how should we clarify?“

So now, which side are you, on the love side or on the correction side? How do you interpret it? How do you interpret Me?

What do you think? What did I say? Derek?

Derek: We have to be both.

Shri Mataji: No! Not simultaneously! Imagine you call somebody for food and hit at the same time! First with love. Let them come in and then. It took Me four years to make these seven great English Sahaja yogis to settle down. There's one sitting there, ask him. They used to come into my house, I would cook for them, I would do this and I started an ashram and did that and gave them everything.

Matt, what do you say? So, in the beginning you have to do that. I told Gregoire very recently: with Germans he went and he just told them off! And ? was upset that, because Gregoire said something, they all ran away! So of course I took the side of Gregoire, because I didn't want to let him down, but I said that, alright, such runaways are there, what can you do? But with Germans I don't have much hopes, I have great hopes from English.

Actually that's why, to My program I have not seen there was any problem, if it is Mataji's program, the whole hall will be filled and then next day all the birds run away. What's the matter? So we have to use, first of all, very gentle methods, very, very gentle. That's the style your Mother has. When you came first to Me, how did I talk to you? Did I say all these things to you? If I had said that, ‛An Englishman, you could be sarcastic,“ you would have gone away the next day! Today I can say, because you know that, because no more Englishman exists there, it is finished now, you are a Sahaja yogi. And you would like to improve yourselves, so If I say anything you wouldn't mind, isn't it? That's what it is.

So one should not do both the things. First, just love: affection, give them food to eat, vibrated food, vibrated salt, this, that, try to look after them even physical side. Then, then gradually you have to tell them, ‛Yes I don't feel vibrations. You feel left Mooladhara, what does that mean — how to tell. Very difficult, you know, it's a funny thing. But you better grow a little bit then we tell you.“ Keep the curiosity on.

Left Mooladhara is a dangerous thing, it's a very bad thing to happen to anyone, left Mooladhara, and on top of that now you are catching on left Swadhishthana! So what is that? It's another one, it's very difficult. Now, among yourselves you should say, ‛What to do with his left Mooladhara? Alright let us see, let us see the mantra, ourselves.“ You form a group yourselves and show complete attention to him that you are concerned, ‛Now where is it, oh it's on the way.“ Talk in the third person. ‛Where is the Kundalini now? On the left Nabhi.“ Now immediately you'll go and ask, ‛Are you alright with your wife?“ finished! Why should you ask? I say because it's a common thing.

Like one fellow came and asked Me, ‛Mother, what's wrong with these people, they are all saying, 'What's wrong with your father?“ I said, ‛Really? Nothing wrong with your father?“ ‛No Mother. There is problem between me and him, but I would not like to discuss it openly.“ I said, ‛Correct. Alright, but they should not say, see they know everything that's what I tell you, but you better know also about it.“ Like that I talked to him. But you need not say, ‛What about your father?“ I've seen people, when they gave Realisation, suddenly they'll ask a question like this. No! You should just talk on Kundalini, ‛It's not here, It has to move, It has to go, It has to do.“ Then you come down, gradually, alright.

We have to be tricky people, Shri Krishna. Otherwise, how are you going to tame these great Englishmen into your fold? They are not fishermen which Christ caught. They are Englishmen, you must know, this also shakes with that name. So be careful when you handle them. I said the art lies in that, alright James?

So now I tell also as a leader that you should see that you combine them beforehand, you must have a meeting before they come in, ‛How we are going to handle them, how we are going to make them come inside. Let us have a proper net spread, so you say something and I say something. Let them feel that we are understanding it. That somebody can say like this, ‛Oh,“ and then another one should say, «Left Vishuddhi.“ No, no, no. You don't ask a person, ‛You feel guilty?“ you should say, ‛One should not feel guilty much in this,“ in a third person talking. Then the person might say, ‛Yea, I feel very guilty,“ you say, ‛What is there to feel guilty?“ Then it's alright. But if you just say, ‛You feel guilty?“, they say, ‛Yes, I feel guilty.“

People are very funny, I must say. Like in San Francisco they said that, ‛We want to destroy ourselves, why do you want to save us?“ Now what do you say after that? I say, ‛Alright, I'm sorry.“ People are very queer all over, they have become strange people. All possessed, all up side down. See, like I feel two belts are moving, one is moving upward, one is moving downward with a great, tremendous people. We are on this one, which is going upward. We have to pull out people from the other belt. You see, they are moving together, trying to pull them. But what is happening? They are moving downward, we are moving upward. So what we have to do, is to somehow or the other to station ourselves in such a way that they feel we are stationary and we pull them. Otherwise, if you think that this is [inaudible], then they think that, ‛Oh, these think no end of themselves, they are pressurising.“ Here they have mentally found out many things, like — nobody should pressurise you, nobody should condition you, nobody should give you ideas. So just talk on Kundalini — in a third person — then you will get them.

Always I had a big group coming to see Me. But the second one will be less and second will be less, because as soon as they see the Sahaja yogis, half of them drop out. Not that they are very good people, they drop out, because they have to be dropped out, doesn't matter, but we should try. They cannot not be of your quality, naturally. Alright, so let us develop a very logical, sensible discretion about it.

Sahaja yogi: Things will get better in Cambridge, Mother.

Shri Mataji: Of course. You have to be good salesmen. There are few words like this, you must say» thank you, sir, of course". «Of course», we'll say, «Is it so», «Of course», or something. ‛Of course" in a good way. If they say, «Can we get cured?», «Of course, why not». Like that. Anything like that if you say, positiveness of yours, they will be happy.

Alright, so now what is another problem; now you, please, see that you go somewhere and work it out. Cambridge must grow, Cambridge must grow, it's very important. This is no discussion needed, nothing, to understand Me is the easiest thing. You don't sit down and take out every hair of Mine and split it. Develop your own discretion. I'm a Mahamaya, you know, if you go into that kind of a trip, you'll never end it. Don't analyse Me at all, be gross about it. Whatever you hear, ‛Alright, this is, Mother has said it. Alright.“Do it! Finished! Don't analyse. If you go to analysis, you lose the synthesis that has been created. You should not analyse anything. Whatever I say, ‛Alright, this is what Mother has said. Alright.“ I'm not contradictory. I don't contradict myself, do I? Then it's alright.

But listen to my lecture; every word and word if you try to split it, you will get nowhere. They are mantras. Every word is a mantra, whatever I say is a mantra. In fact. I won't use a particular word at a particular time, if it doesn't fit into the mantra. Even My movements; you know, the whole Universe moves with this, you know that very well. So, everything has a great meaning. So you just don't go and try to split Me and to understand Me intelligently. You cannot! Nobody can understand. I have no intelligence, to such an extent that I am beyond your intelligence. I am beyond. You don't try to split Me into words, into thing. That’s not…you can't do it. Whatever I've said it, you take it, put it down. Alright. Now, any other problem, any other thing you have, you tell Me. Yes, doctor?

Sahaja yogi: [INAUDIBLE] without the outcome coming arrogant, as You have described the English as being. Could You explain what the sense of real word involves?

Shri Mataji: Now let's see from where the word comes. First of all let's see the origin of the word. Origin of the word is paravani, that's called as paravani, is beyond the sound, beyond the sound, paravani, the energy. Energy of sound is called as paravani, alright? This paravani is represented within us in our stomach, is there. It is in the stomach first of all. And then it ascends gradually from stomach. It is the part where it starts throbbing, supposing somebody has a cancer for the stomach, then you can feel the throbbing in that area. You want to find out if somebody has a cancer in the stomach, you put your finger in this and you find a throbbing coming away. Of course it is not vice versa also that if there is throbbing there is cancer! But if there is cancer invariably there has to be throbbing. There has to be no throbbing in the stomach. If there is throbbing then that means: there is something wrong with us. So first the obstruction takes place through that paravani in the stomach and that is how this obstruction there makes the sound, ‛lap, dap lap, dap, lap, dap.“ Alright. Then it rises higher into the heart. Into the heart the same sound becomes audible. When it becomes audible, when you start hearing it. That happens because that energy makes the heart pump, and that pumping makes the sound. But is anahat, is the one, which is without the percussion. Then the same sound, energy, goes in the Vishuddhi Chakra. When it goes to the Vishuddhi Chakra, then it is pashyanti, it is the one that sees, [INAUDIBLE] here [INAUDIBLE] here it is [INAUDIBLE]. Pashyanti means ‛it sees“. It sees that sound. Just sees. Means: if there is any sound anywhere, it sees that, it knows, it sees. It’s the witness state of the sound here. And on this sound only you have seen how animals, everybody lives with that sound, act with that sound. Say, an animal, supposing there's one type of a sound, is going on, ‛tap, tap, tap,“ continuously — it knows everything is fine. But if there's any change, it knows there's a change. So the sound at Vishuddhi, it becomes a pashyanti, means the one that sees. Any sound comes, we immediately start seeing. It acts [inaudible]. Any sound, so it is in the pashyanti state. But then it becomes vaikhari, in the sound box. Vaikhari means it speaks. So now, it comes from paravani, madhyama, here, then it becomes pashyanti and then it becomes vaikhari, which speaks. Alright. So when it speaks, then it is modulated by many things that is, it is all connected with brains. We are connected to the brain. The brain has two sides: one is the conditioning and other is the ego. And these two sides act on the Vishuddhi as you know that here first crossing takes place at this [inaudible]. So at Vishuddhi, if you have a right side Vishuddhi, you are arrogant, you are blunt, you say things just like that without feeling what another person is going to feel about it, how he is going to react or anything. Why? I ask the question. In the centre resides Shri Krishna, and Shri Krishna is madhurya, is sweetness. Because you have diverted yourself from there, you become harsh. On the left hand side is the Vishnumaya, is the power. Right side is Vitthala, «tha, tha», like they say in [INAUDIBLE] speech, what we use in the most of Sanskrit language they'll say that when you have to describe the [INAUDIBLE] of war, if you have to describe the war, you have to use ‛tha, tha, tha“. These are the things, ‛tha, tha“. The Vitthala, Vitthala, Vitthala as you say here. This ‛tha,“ is the sign that [inaudible] also Indian language or even Sanskrit language is like we say, have to [INAUDIBLE] hit somebody, ‛thakkar" all these words we use. So the language is phonetic as well as expressive. So what happens that on the right side you become ‛tha, tha, dha, na“, speak like that.

Left side is Vishnumaya. Vishnumaya is the one is the accumulation of the clouds and when they rock, you get the Vishnumaya, is the electricity. So it comes like a electrical thing, so [inaudible] what you call the sarcasm. It is accumulation of all these conditionings within us that will suddenly come up. So these two reactions take place of this energy, which is here as ‛dha“, ‛dha“. Can you say it? Is a mild «tha». So this «dha» that is within us is to be used as an indication of our sweetness, gentleness. But some people who are gentle by force, they are forced to be gentle, then suddenly they come up as with Vishnumaya. You see, they have be normally gentle, alright, and very kind, very nice this and that. Then you crack at a point. When you crack, then you say something sarcastic or you may use right side also, but mostly it's sarcastic, because that's how you give an outlet to your conditionings. So that's how these two things happen, alright. But in the centre is [inaudible], think of Shri Krishna, of His childhood, what pranks He used to play. How sweet He was, how He used to play with the mother, how He stole the butter. And that's why He said butter is the solution, ghee is the solution for making your sound sweet, your talking sweet you have to be like butter.

There's a Sanskrit couplet, beautiful, not really Sanskrit, but it translates like this, ‛Some people say that a saint's heart is like butter, but butter melts when it is heated, but a saint's heart melts when others are heated.“

So you are saints. So to be in the centre here that's the best way. And I must say Vishuddhi is a big, big, big problem in England. Especially left Vishuddhi is so much. You know I get such terrible pains all over with left Vishuddhi. So one should talk very sweetly. Now, who promises Me that? Let Me see the hands. You are promising Me, alright? You are promising Adi Shakti! Remember that. Be careful!

Right hand, better put up right hand.

Thank you.

May God bless you.